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The Greening of School Facilities: What It Means for Learning

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 The Greening of School Facilities: What It Means for Learning(08/24/2010) 
9:35
EdWeek Producer: Jennifer: 
Today's chat, "The Greening of School Facilities: What It Means for Learning," is open for questions. Please start submitting them now.

The chat itself will begin at 2 p.m. Eastern. Thanks for joining us!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 9:35 EdWeek Producer: Jennifer
2:00
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Hello everyone and welcome to today's chat! We have two very special guests today who are going to walk us through the ins and outs of green school facilities-- Kim Dempsey and Emily Knupp.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:00 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:00
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Could you both please introduce yourselves?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:00 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:01
Kim Dempsey: 
Hi, Katie! NCB Capital Impact is a national non-profit community development organization and I am our director of innovation and strategy. In that role I manage some of our innovations, including our green charter school initiative.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:01 Kim Dempsey
2:01
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Excellent! Welcome, Kim.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:01 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:02
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Let's go ahead and get started on some questions.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:02 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:02
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
To start - I was hoping, Kim, that you might be able to explain what "green" means when it comes to school facilities.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:02 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:04
Kim Dempsey: 
Sure. By green we really mean sustainable. Sustainable facilities have systems that use less energy than traditional systems (i.e. less water, electricity, etc.) They also might use recycled or recyclable materials; environmentally friendly cleaning products, etc.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:04 Kim Dempsey
2:04
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Excellent.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:04 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:04
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Here's a question from Stacy that I think a lot of people wonder about when they hear about green facilities.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:04 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:05
[Comment From StacyStacy: ] 
I see the value of energy efficiency, natural lighting and green design, but can this be done for public schools in ways that their communities can afford?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:05 Stacy
2:06
Kim Dempsey: 
Absolutely Stacy! There is increasing evidence that green schools can be built for the same (or sometimes less!) cost than traditional schools. And, the cost savings that are realized over the long term (due to more energy efficient facilities) can be invested back into the schools themselves: for hiring and retaining teachers, academic enrichment, etrc.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:06 Kim Dempsey
2:07
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Interesting - it's always been my impression that when it comes to building sustainably, there is somewhat of an investment up front that can even out over time in energy savings.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:07 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:08
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Here's a question from C.A.S that touches on the question we just answered, but has another aspect to it as well.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:08 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:08
[Comment From C.A.S.C.A.S.: ] 
Is it costly to incorporate "green" design into school buildings? Can you add "green" elements into schools that have already been built, or is it just for new construction?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:08 C.A.S.
2:08
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Can older school buildings be made green?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:08 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:08
Kim Dempsey: 
Katie, there are actually a number of studies that have been done on the costs of greening schools. And the results vary a bit. The bottom line is that it really depends on the location, what types of green elements you want to incorporate, and how early on in the process you integrate those elements.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:08 Kim Dempsey
2:10
Kim Dempsey: 
Thanks C.A.S. Yes, you can add green elements into existing schools. In fact, there is a LEED program specifically for existing schools. However, there is great benefit to integrating green design into a new building from the start; both in terms of cost and in terms of realizing the full energy and cost-saving potential of going green.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:10 Kim Dempsey
2:10
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Cool. Here's a follow-up question from AES.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:10 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:10
[Comment From AESAES: ] 
Where would I find those studies? We are renovating our school and would like to include as many green elements as possible. It is difficult, however, to determine the cost of say daylighting when replacing a roof because you do not know what you are going to find once you begin.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:10 AES
2:11
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Sounds like they are encountering what you just described, Kim.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:11 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:11
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Do you know where interested folks might be able to find resources about this topic?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:11 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:12
Kim Dempsey: 
AES: first, I'd like to encourage you to think about the cost/benefit analysis both in terms of upfront costs as well as long-term cost savings. Second, our Sustainable Answer Key has a few case studies that might be helpful in terms of figuring out how to do this type of analysis for something like daylighting. Finally, check out the Heschong Mahone Group study on daylighting and its benefits. It's makes a great argument for daylighting's effect on academic achivement.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:12 Kim Dempsey
2:13
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Cool - that ties into our next question from Dawn Shrum.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:13 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:13
[Comment From Dawn ShrumDawn Shrum: ] 
Is there documented evidence that "green" practices improve student performance. I've heard mixed reviews.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:13 Dawn Shrum
2:13
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
How do sustainable facilities tie into academic learning?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:13 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:13
[Comment From Emily KnuppEmily Knupp: ] 
Hi everyone, this is Emily Knupp from the U.S. Green Building Council!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:13 Emily Knupp
2:13
[Comment From Emily KnuppEmily Knupp: ] 
So sorry, for technical difficuluties.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:13 Emily Knupp
2:14
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Hi, Emily! Would you like to introduce yourself?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:14 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:14
Emily Knupp: 
Thanks. I am the K12 Schools Associate at USGBC, working with schools and districts across the country to learn about green buildings.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:14 Emily Knupp
2:14
Kim Dempsey: 
Hi, Dawn. Yes, we've seen mixed reviews as well. But there seems to be a growing body of evidence to support that certain green design elements do have a positive effect on student performance. We reference many of these studies in the Sustainable Answer Key.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:14 Kim Dempsey
2:15
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
By the way - there is a link to the Sustainable Answer Key on this page, below the chat box.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:15 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:16
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Melissa Malkin-Weber has a practical question about construction.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:16 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:16
[Comment From Melissa Malkin-WeberMelissa Malkin-Weber: ] 
My organization, Self-Help Credit Union is a lender. Often when we see projects, they are already designed and have a construction budget. We'd like for our borrowers to be taking advantage of the benefits of green schools. Do you have suggestions about what influence points would be for the lender?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:16 Melissa Malkin-Weber
2:16
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Emily - do you have any advice for Melissa?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:16 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:17
Emily Knupp: 
We often say that the best way to avoid so-called "green premiums" (the added costs that are perceived to come with green buildings), is to incorporate them as early on as possible in the design process.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:17 Emily Knupp
2:17
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
That makes sense. Kim was saying that earlier, too.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:17 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:17
Kim Dempsey: 
Melissa, NCB Capital Impact is facilitating a Sustainable Charter Schools Working Group to look at that very issue. How can we encourage or incentivize schools to go green (and to do it early on in the project lifecycle?) There are definitely some programs out there successfully doing just that and we'd like to replicate and expand them, where feasible.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:17 Kim Dempsey
2:17
Emily Knupp: 
...however, I think it would be great if more lender's were familiar with the kinds of green technologies that can be implemented at any point in a facility's design, build, or ongoing operations.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:17 Emily Knupp
2:18
Emily Knupp: 
Melissas, to add to Kim's point, the Answer Key is a great primer on green building...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:18 Emily Knupp
2:18
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Definitely - so more education and awareness about the topic?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:18 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:19
Kim Dempsey: 
Yes, and more resources (i.e. money!) to encourage schools to consider building or renovating a green facility.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:19 Kim Dempsey
2:19
Emily Knupp: 
Absolutely Katie. USGBC also has a resource, the Paid from Savings Guide to Green Existing Buildings, tha can help both lenders and building owners (and leasers) find ways to finance green projects.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:19 Emily Knupp
2:19
Emily Knupp: 
The Paid From Savings Guide can be found at www.usgbc.org.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:19 Emily Knupp
2:20
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
George Shaw had a comment/question that seems to relate to this.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:20 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:20
[Comment From George ShawGeorge Shaw: ] 
We hear recently that federal changes eliminate the ability of third parties to get the tax benefit that public schools cannot in the installation of photovoltaic and other renewable energy systems in schools. What is being or can be done to replace these now former incentives?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:20 George Shaw
2:20
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Are you aware of this change? And how can it be compensated for?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:20 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:20
Kim Dempsey: 
George, are you talking about solar tax credits?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:20 Kim Dempsey
2:21
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Hm - I'm not sure he's still with us, but I will post his answer if he is!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:21 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:21
[Comment From George ShawGeorge Shaw: ] 
Yes, exactly.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:21 George Shaw
2:23
Kim Dempsey: 
Thanks, George. That must be a very recent federal change b/c we know of several cases where schools have worked out just these types of agreements with private parties getting the benefit of the tax credits. If that's the case, we will definitely want to investigate other potential incentives to get corporations involved.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:23 Kim Dempsey
2:23
Emily Knupp: 
George - I'll admit that federal initiatives isn't my area of expertise, but I'd be glad to follow up with our advocacy team for more information...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:23 Emily Knupp
2:24
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
sounds good.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:24 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:24
Kim Dempsey: 
We think NMTCs (New Markets Tax Credits) can be used to support the financing of solar panels and it's something we're investigating right now.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:24 Kim Dempsey
2:24
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Kristin has a follow-up question about greening charter schools.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:24 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:24
[Comment From KristinKristin: ] 
As a new charter school operator, I'd like to follow up on Melissa's question. Can you speak to the lending side of "greening" a building? Are there certain benefits, etc. a charter operator should be asking the lender? The costs as we've noted are needed up-front, but given the financing realities of charters, that seems tricky to work out.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:24 Kristin
2:24
Emily Knupp: 
...and to Kim's point, there are a lot of schools and inistitutions that work out successful public private partnerships with utility companies.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:24 Emily Knupp
2:26
Kim Dempsey: 
Hi, Kristin. Some of the most innovative financing structures we've seen tie the repayment of the loan to the cost savings projected to be realized as a result of the installation of more energy efficient systems. Those models of complicated, as you can imagine, but they make a lot of sense in terms of only financing what you will be able to repay based on projected savings.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:26 Kim Dempsey
2:26
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Interesting. Is that something that's discussed in the Sustainable Answer Key, Kim?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:26 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:27
Emily Knupp: 
Kristin and Katie, this is something outlined in the Paid From Savings Guide I mentioned earlier.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:27 Emily Knupp
2:27
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
I see. Great.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:27 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:27
Kim Dempsey: 
Also, Kristin, we'll need to work with appraisers to be sure that they understand how to include the value of green-er systems in their valuation of facilities. Inclusion of those elements in the building's appraised value will help lenders get comfortable with larger loans.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:27 Kim Dempsey
2:27
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Hope that helps, Kristin!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:27 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:28
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Emily - would you like to talk about LEED certifications and what they mean for schools?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:28 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:28
Emily Knupp: 
Specifically in the PFS guide, Kristin, (and elswhere), you may want to look into "performance contracting" as a financing mechanism.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:28 Emily Knupp
2:28
Emily Knupp: 
Sure Katie...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:28 Emily Knupp
2:29
Emily Knupp: 
...the LEED green building rating system (LEED stands for Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design) provides buildings with third-party certification that they are built as designed, and operate as intended...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:29 Emily Knupp
2:30
Emily Knupp: 
...there is a LEED rating system for all points of a building's lifecycle, with LEED for Schools designed to meet the specific needs of educational faciltiies.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:30 Emily Knupp
2:30
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Cool. Are the certifications for new buildings only?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:30 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:31
Emily Knupp: 
A project team pursues prereqs and credits within the rating system, within five credit categories, addressing site selection, energy management and source, water efficiency, indoor environmental quality, and materials secltion.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:31 Emily Knupp
2:31
Kim Dempsey: 
What's great about LEED is that the checklist is so helpful whether or not you are intending to go for LEED certification. It's a great primer to help schools get a handle on what green design elements to even consider for their facility project.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:31 Kim Dempsey
2:32
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
That makes sense. So it's a good place to start looking at which aspects of your facility could be made more green?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:32 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:32
Emily Knupp: 
that's right Katie and Kim. If you step back from the LEED checklist, and make your wish list of green features and sustainability goals, you'll find many, if not all of them are included in LEED.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:32 Emily Knupp
2:33
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Excellent. It sounds fairly comprehensive.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:33 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:33
Kim Dempsey: 
Absolutely. And I'll say that the Sustainable Answer Key also gives an overview of the major green design elements -- along with examples/case studies of schools that have implemented them
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:33 Kim Dempsey
2:33
Emily Knupp: 
Agreed. LEED also applies to existing facilities, through oeprations and maintenance policies, procedures, and plans as well...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:33 Emily Knupp
2:33
Emily Knupp: 
...with the LEED for Existing Buildings: Operations & Maintenance rating system.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:33 Emily Knupp
2:34
Emily Knupp: 
We like to say that the greenest building is one that is already built.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:34 Emily Knupp
2:34
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Wow. The amount of possibilities seems like it could get overwhelming, so it seems like a great idea to break it down into small sections to work on individually.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:34 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:34
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
I like that, Emily!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:34 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:34
Emily Knupp: 
That's a good point Katie (and thanks! :))
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:34 Emily Knupp
2:34
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Kirk had a question about greening outdoor spaces in schools earlier.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:34 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:35
[Comment From KirkKirk: ] 
I'm interested in the pedagogy of installing schoolyard green spaces and outdoor classrooms for student achievement. The cost/benefit ratio seems like a no brainer compared to bricks & mortar construction costs. Do you have any data or thoughts on greening school grounds?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:35 Kirk
2:35
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
How big a part do school grounds play in this?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:35 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:36
Emily Knupp: 
While designating specific outdoor classrooms and similar spaces isn't directly outlines in LEED, we see projects doing this more and more...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:36 Emily Knupp
2:36
Emily Knupp: 
There is incredible value for students in teachers in connecting them to the outdoor environment.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:36 Emily Knupp
2:36
Kim Dempsey: 
We talked with so many schools that extoll the virtues of a simple school garden space as a teaching tool for their students. They grow the food, eat the food, compost the scraps and really learn a lot about where food comes from and what it takes to grow it yourself.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:36 Kim Dempsey
2:36
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Absolutely - I would think greening outdoor spaces would help emphasize the "green" philosophy and mindset to students, teachers, and the community.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:36 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:37
Emily Knupp: 
Totally. There is a school in Manassas Park, Va, that has outdoor classroom space, and a connection the surrounding woods from every classroom -indoors and out.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:37 Emily Knupp
2:37
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
And like Kirk mentioned, growing a garden takes a lot less of a budget than renovating or building a completely new school.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:37 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:37
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Wow - that sounds amazing.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:37 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:37
Emily Knupp: 
Check out Manassas Park Elementary School on the web when you can! It's a great place that instills a real sense of environmental steweardship for its community.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:37 Emily Knupp
2:38
Kim Dempsey: 
Also, many schools talk about making the green elements as visible as possible (vs. hiding the systems). So that's another way of providing "green school grounds". If students can see water collection tanks or the clerestory windows or the multi-use spaces, the experiential learning can go to a whole new level.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:38 Kim Dempsey
2:38
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Definitely. I'm writing it down right now.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:38 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:38
Emily Knupp: 
Kim is right...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:38 Emily Knupp
2:38
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Neat!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:38 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:39
Emily Knupp: 
...I've been on tours of green schools where the students can explain the geothermal and HVAC systems better than the architects!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:39 Emily Knupp
2:39
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Wow
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:39 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:39
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
That's a great learning opportunity.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:39 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:39
Emily Knupp: 
the learning opportunities are everywhere. A green school that doesn't tap into those is missing a huge opportunity.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:39 Emily Knupp
2:39
Emily Knupp: 
Any school facility, really.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:39 Emily Knupp
2:39
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Here's another federal question.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:39 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:39
[Comment From GuestGuest: ] 
I've seen proposals (HR 5989, for example) in Congress that would mandate particular LEED, Energy Star, or CHPS rating in conjunction with well-intentioned grant programs designed to provide capital incentives for green building. Does this pose a problem, or are there other ways to promote grren without requiring an often costly certification?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:39 Guest
2:40
Kim Dempsey: 
Indeed. And at Prairie Crossing Charter School in ILL, students purchase and decorate water collection barrels and sell them to other schools: educational, peer enrichment, and they raised enough money to install rain gutters on one of their buildings!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:40 Kim Dempsey
2:40
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Seems like a win-win situation, Kim.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:40 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:40
Emily Knupp: 
That's a good question from the "guest" at 2:39...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:40 Emily Knupp
2:41
Emily Knupp: 
There are now 12 states and DC that require some kind of green school construction (LEED, CHPS, others...). Those areas are real living laboratories of the costs and benefits of green buildings, and we're still waiting to see what kind of hurdles they may come up against...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:41 Emily Knupp
2:42
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Interesting. How long has that been going on, Emily?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:42 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:42
Emily Knupp: 
...in many cases, there are funding incentives tied to the mandates, in order to cover those potential first costs...but as Kim said, the return on initial investments for energy and water-efficiecnt strategies can be very fast.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:42 Emily Knupp
2:42
[Comment From Corey Carlisle, LIIFCorey Carlisle, LIIF: ] 
Sorry, I forgot to include my name in that legislative question. My name is Corey Carlisle, and I'm the policy director at the Low Income Investment Fund (LIIF).
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:42 Corey Carlisle, LIIF
2:43
Emily Knupp: 
Katie - the state policies?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:43 Emily Knupp
2:43
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Yes.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:43 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:43
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Is that recent?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:43 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:43
Emily Knupp: 
I'm not 100% sure, but i know some go back as far as 2007 and 08.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:43 Emily Knupp
2:43
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Interesting. I was just wondering when we might see what that impact really is.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:43 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:44
Emily Knupp: 
States and municipalities are adopting this kind of legislation all the time though.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:44 Emily Knupp
2:44
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Usually it takes a few years to get a good feel for it and get all the kinks worked out as well.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:44 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:44
Emily Knupp: 
That's true Katie, and the adoptions are to varying degrees "of green".
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:44 Emily Knupp
2:44
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
I see.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:44 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:44
Emily Knupp: 
You can learn more about the policies at www.usgbc.org/government
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:44 Emily Knupp
2:45
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Thanks, Emily!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:45 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:45
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Corey has a follow-up question:
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:45 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:45
[Comment From Corey Carlisle, LIIFCorey Carlisle, LIIF: ] 
Follow up questions, what's the typical cost(s) to get that type of certification?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:45 Corey Carlisle, LIIF
2:45
Kim Dempsey: 
I'd add to this discussion - and to address Corey - that there are many ways to promote green without requiring certification and we are certainly interested in promoting those from our Sustainable Charter Schools Working Group for charter schools in particular. That said, the ongoing monitoring of operations and maintenance that comes with certification can help a school ensure they are getting maximum benefit from their sustainable facility. Of course, there is a cost and we want to encourage as many incentives as possible.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:45 Kim Dempsey
2:46
Kim Dempsey: 
I'll defer to Emily on the cost of LEED certification...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:46 Kim Dempsey
2:47
Emily Knupp: 
The cost to register and certify a LEED project is based on the project’s square footage. For a 100,000 square foot school, LEED registration and certification fees are less than $4,000. Prices are determined by the Green Building Certification Institute (GBCI). Complete pricing information can be found at their website, www.gbci.org...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:47 Emily Knupp
2:48
[Comment From Corey Carlisle, LIIFCorey Carlisle, LIIF: ] 
Thank you, very helpful!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:48 Corey Carlisle, LIIF
2:48
Emily Knupp: 
...GBCI is the independent organization that manages LEED certification, whereas USGBC develops the LEED rating system.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:48 Emily Knupp
2:48
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Excellent. Thanks, Emily.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:48 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:48
Kim Dempsey: 
And Corey, I don't have immediate access to the costs of CHPS or Energy Star but I'm sure their websites would have that level of detailed information as well.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:48 Kim Dempsey
2:48
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Education Week reporter Sarah Sparks send me a couple of questions to pose as well.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:48 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:49
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
"To what extent do you think interest in “green facilities” is being driven by dwindling school budgets, versus any social or educational goals of the school?"
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:49 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:49
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
And
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:49 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:49
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
"How often are these programs integrated into the larger curriculum?"
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:49 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:49
Emily Knupp: 
Great questions Sarah... I'll take them one at a time. :)
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:49 Emily Knupp
2:49
Kim Dempsey: 
Me, too!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:49 Kim Dempsey
2:50
Emily Knupp: 
First, I would say the need to save money is a key driver for schools' interest in going green, but it really varies from one community to the next...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:50 Emily Knupp
2:50
Emily Knupp: 
In some cases, a community or school leadersship has a history of environmental stewardship, and they have been doing "green things" for years...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:50 Emily Knupp
2:51
Kim Dempsey: 
From the schools we've spoken with, the overwhelming majority are building/renovating green facilities to achieve the educational and performance goals and treat these as equal in importance to the potential cost savings.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:51 Kim Dempsey
2:51
Emily Knupp: 
in other cases, schools see the chance to save thousands (even hundreds of thousands) of dollares each year on utilitiy cots, and now is the time to act.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:51 Emily Knupp
2:51
Kim Dempsey: 
I would hazard to say that all green schools find a way to integrate their sustainable facility into their curriculum...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:51 Kim Dempsey
2:52
Emily Knupp: 
When it comes to making the case fo going green, it's important to speak to the values of the school community. With green schools, they really are a triple-win, for the planet, the people, and the pocketbook.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:52 Emily Knupp
2:52
Kim Dempsey: 
It's such a potentially powerful teaching tool; allowing teachers to shape the next generation of environmental stewards.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:52 Kim Dempsey
2:52
Emily Knupp: 
Absolutely Kim.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:52 Emily Knupp
2:53
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Definitely. That ties back into what we were talking about earlier, too, in terms of turning the sustainable aspects of the facility into "teachable moments."
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:53 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:53
Emily Knupp: 
There are certainly green school buildings out there that aren't taking advantage of the educational opportuntiies, but USGBC is working on resources to make sure all schools can impart some level of green lessons.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:53 Emily Knupp
2:54
Emily Knupp: 
Organizations like the Green Education Foundation provide resources for teachers to implement ready-made programs into their classroom curriculum.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:54 Emily Knupp
2:54
Emily Knupp: 
www.greeneducationfoundation.org
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:54 Emily Knupp
2:55
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Great! Thanks for the resource.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:55 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:55
Emily Knupp: 
You bet!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:55 Emily Knupp
2:55
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Excellent. We're just about out of time here, but we have a couple more minutes.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:55 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:55
Kim Dempsey: 
Yes. And as schools are often a community anchor, think of the potential effects a green school facility could have on the surrounding neighborhoods. Sustainable schools can manage community gardens; host health-related workshops; showcase themselves as a laboratory for all the benefits of going green and serve as models for other types of buildings.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:55 Kim Dempsey
2:56
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Emily and Kim - do you have any advice for schools who want to get started but aren't sure where? What would you tell them to get them involved in this?
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:56 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:56
Kim Dempsey: 
Absolutely...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:56 Kim Dempsey
2:56
Emily Knupp: 
Yes!...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:56 Emily Knupp
2:57
Kim Dempsey: 
My last shameless plug: we designed the Sustainable Answer Key to be that starting point for charter schools but, really, the tools and information provided in the guide are relevant for any school interested in going green.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:57 Kim Dempsey
2:57
Emily Knupp: 
Find (and join!) your local USGBC Chapter. These are independent, volunteer-driven nonprofits that carry the mission of USGBC to bring green buildings for all within this generation...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:57 Emily Knupp
2:57
Emily Knupp: 
Each chapter has some level of commitment to green schools, most through a Green Schools Committee.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:57 Emily Knupp
2:58
Emily Knupp: 
Find the one near you at www.usgbc.org/chapters...
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:58 Emily Knupp
2:58
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Excellent!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:58 Moderator: Katie Ash
2:58
Emily Knupp: 
or visit www.GreenSchoolBuildings.org to learn more about LEED and green schools in general (and to connect to the Green Schools Committee directly).
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:58 Emily Knupp
2:59
Kim Dempsey: 
Katie, generally, a school will want to start by assessing its goals vis a vis green. How a sustainable facility fits into their existing mission or curriculum or how the mission/curriculum could be altered to support the development of a green facility. Also, the guide has a number of specifics from schools that have already taken the leap and many have good lessons to share!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:59 Kim Dempsey
2:59
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Awesome!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 2:59 Moderator: Katie Ash
3:00
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
This chat will be posted here with all the links for anyone to come back and view.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 3:00 Moderator: Katie Ash
3:00
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
Thank you so much Kim and Emily for all the fantastic information you've shared with us today.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 3:00 Moderator: Katie Ash
3:00
Emily Knupp: 
It was a pleasure!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 3:00 Emily Knupp
3:00
EdWeek Producer: Jennifer: 
And thanks to Katie Ash for moderating. A printable transcript of this chat will be available tomorrow on this same page.

Make sure to check out http://www.edweek.org/go/chats for other upcoming Education Week chats, including one this Friday at 12 p.m. Eastern, on how schools in New Orleans are recovering five years after Hurricane Katrina.
Tuesday August 24, 2010 3:00 EdWeek Producer: Jennifer
3:00
Moderator: Katie Ash: 
And thanks to all our guests who have submitted questions during the chat!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 3:00 Moderator: Katie Ash
3:00
Kim Dempsey: 
Thanks, all, for your participation and please feel free to contact me (kdempsey@ncbcapitalimpact.org) with any questions!
Tuesday August 24, 2010 3:00 Kim Dempsey
3:00
 

 
 
 

The Greening of School Facilities: What It Means for Learning

Tuesday, August 24, 2 p.m. Eastern time


"The Sustainable Answer Key," a guide to incorporating sustainable, energy-efficient elements into charter school buildings, was recently released jointly by NCB Capital Impact and the U.S. Green Building Council. Join representatives from both those organizations to discuss ways charter and regular schools can create high-performing, energy-efficient school buildings. Our guests discussed the academic effects of high-performing school facilities, what makes a school “green,” the ins and outs of LEED certification, and the costs and benefits of building and maintaining such facilities.

Guests:
Kim Dempsey, director of strategy and innovation, NCB Capital Impact
Emily Knupp, K-12 schools associate, U.S. Green Building Council
Katie Ash, staff writer, Education Week Digital Directions, moderated this chat.

Related Story:
  • Goin' Green (Education Week Digital Directions, October 20, 2008)
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